Thermal Treatment of Organic Containments and PFAs with TerraTherm's SVP Jim Galligan

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So myth #1, Thermal.
Conducting heating TCH is

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ineffective.
Below the water table.

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Yeah, I would say that's false.
It's like everything else, it's,

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it's a design consideration.
So we've done a ton of sites

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with TCH treating contaminants
to the very low concentrations

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below the water table.
I would say that anytime you're

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treating a contaminant below the
water table, it's really going

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to end up having to be something
that could could be treated

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effectively at 100° C, the
boiling point of water, or

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slightly higher if you've got a
big hydrostatic head from the

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water table above.
Welcome to the Environmental

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Welcome to the Environmental
Transformation Podcast.

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I'm your host, Sean Grady, and
today's guest is Jim Galligan.

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Jim has over 34 years of.
Experience with in situ and exit

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you remediation systems.
He's also the Senior Vice

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President of Terra Therm and
we're really excited to have Jim

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come on the show today and talk
a little bit about his

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experience, what he's doing at
Terra Therm and all the great

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things they're doing for our
clients and for helping

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remediate recalcitrant type
chemicals in situ.

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Jim, welcome to the show.
Great to be here.

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Thanks for having me, Sean.
Absolutely.

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So, you know, tell us a little
bit about your role there at

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Terra Therm, if you could, Jim,
and, and how long you've been

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there and, and all that good
stuff.

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Sure.
I'm, I'm the business unit

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manager at, at Terra Therm, but
I, I joined the company when it

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started, when it was originally
founded back in February of

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2000.
So been there just over 25

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years.
Very, yeah, very happy to be

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celebrating our our 25th
anniversary this year.

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You know, my day-to-day
functions is really to just make

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sure that all of our projects
are completed successfully from

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both the technical standpoint,
safety, economic and client

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satisfaction.
So you know, we've got a, a

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pretty good team, project
managers, engineers, our shop

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fabrication team and the field
construction and operations

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team.
So my, my job is to basically

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make sure that they all have the
resources to do what they need

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to deliver successful projects
for our clients.

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And then on the on the business
side, I do, you know, budgeting,

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forecasting, reporting up to our
our corporate parents at Cascade

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and estimating every once in a
while I get to get out in the

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field and turn some wrenches.
See a project or two.

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Yeah.
Yeah, I know.

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And sometimes when you reach to
a certain level, you just kind

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of you don't have time to get
out in the field anymore.

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You're kind of doing the
operations and the paperwork and

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the the other, you know,
required tasks that are at hand.

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Well, that's good to hear.
So, you know, for the listeners,

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I think a lot of people have
maybe a perception about what

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thermal treatment is, but what
are the different types of

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advanced thermal technologies
that Terra Therm offers?

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So 3 primary thermal
technologies are.

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Our primary technology is
thermal conduction heating or

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TCH.
There's another similar

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technology called electrical
resistance heating or ERH and

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then steam enhanced extraction
or S EE as it's sometimes

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called.
And we can use those

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technologies either
independently or if the geology

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calls for it combined.
So thermal conduction heating

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we're pushing or yeah, just
pushing heat through the soil.

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So there's no, there's no
electrical current.

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The heaters are completely
isolated from the the ground.

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With electrical resistance
heating, we put network of

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electrodes in the ground and
we're actually pushing current

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through the ground using the
reply voltage to the electrodes

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and the current flows through
the ground to adjacent

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electrodes.
That that technology, the ERH

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technology really relies on the
soil moisture in the ground to

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help conduct the electricity and
the soil type really determines

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the resistance.
So that ERH is, is most

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applicable to contaminants that
can be treated at about 100°C or

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maybe slightly higher if there's
a little bit of hydrostatic head

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pressure.
And then steam enhanced

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extraction with that, we're,
we're generally using a boiler

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or steam generator and injecting
steam into the ground under

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pressure to drive the
contaminants to our extraction

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wells and, and take them out.
So thermal conduction heating,

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ERH and and steam are really
like I said, limited to

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compounds that can be treated at
about 100° C where thermal

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conduction heating can in the
right environments can go to

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much higher temperatures up you
know, 300 to 500°C to treat

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higher boiling compounds like
PCBS, PAHS, your, you know, coal

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tars, MGP site residuals, you
know, dioxins and and of course

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PFAS, which is the the top.
This is the big yeah.

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That thing is, boy, it's driving
the industry, isn't it?

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It is really taking over you.
Know a lot of that.

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So Jim, what are like the best
or what are the the best

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appropriate depths to treat or
deploy this technology to treat

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the contaminants?
For, for thermal conduction

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heating our partners over in
Europe production.

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And then we we're currently
working on a design for a site

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that's about 300 feet deep for a
thermal conduction.

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And then for the steam enhanced
extraction, we did a site in the

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Mesa, AZ that was over 250 feet
below ground surface.

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So really the depth isn't isn't
a problem for most, you know

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most soil and groundwater
contamination depths.

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Interesting, That's good.
That's good to know.

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So depth isn't a limitation?
It seems like to consider

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thermal.
No, even on a, when you're

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looking at a thermal project in
general, I was going to say, you

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know, a deeper site actually
ends up being cheaper on a on a

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unit cost basis, you know,
because it's, it's individual

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wells to a deeper depth versus
having a big shallow footprint

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that's spread out.
So you know, typically we would

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say deeper is cheaper on a on a
unit cost basis for most thermal

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sites.
And so, you know, what type of,

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what are some of the, I guess
ideal remedial projects that are

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great for thermal treatment can
maybe explain to the listener,

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if you have this type of a
scenario on your site, this

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could be a good candidate.
I mean, what are some of the,

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you know, ideal type projects?
Yeah, I think thermal treatment

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is really a source zone
remediation technology.

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So it's, it's going after the
heart of the contamination.

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So it's, it's not necessarily
the the technology would use to

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chase a mile long groundwater
plume, but the source at the

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head of that groundwater plume.
So, you know, it's it's really

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ideal for high concentration,
high mass contaminant source

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zones, you know, particularly
where you've got either a

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challenging geology like a, a
silt or clay, or, you know, a

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bedrock or fractured bedrock
zone where you've got

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recalcitrant type contaminants
that you mentioned earlier, like

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APCETCEPCBS, dioxins, P fast
compounds, those those sorts of

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things.
MGP waste from manufactured gas

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plants.
That's obviously something

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that's deep enough where it's
not very easy to just go

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excavate it out and and digging
hall and take it away.

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You know, I think one of the
other things we're seeing now is

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a lot of the easy thermal sites
that are out in the middle of

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the field have kind of been
done.

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And now we're we're starting to
see quite a few sites that have

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got physical challenges.
So buildings or utilities or you

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know, other infrastructure
that's in the middle of the

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thermal treatment zone.
So, you know, we, we've done a

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bunch of angled wells under
buildings, you know, working

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inside buildings, working around
obstacles, working around

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utilities.
We've had large diameter storm

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drain lines, gas lines running
through our thermal treatment

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zone.
So I think a lot of those, you

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know, challenging infrastructure
elements too are becoming part

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of sites that are candidates for
thermal technology.

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And I would say the other, the
other thing that I would say in

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particular for thermal is a site
where you've got a, you know, a

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defined clean up goal where you
need to either remove a lot of

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mass quickly or you need to
reach low concentration

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standards and, and have
confidence that you're going to

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get to those low standards.
So I think thermal is, you know,

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is great for that.
It's it's safe, it's reliable,

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it's effective, and it's quick.
So when you previously you

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talked about different types of
technology, you have, you have

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the, I guess the, the steam heat
and, and you're collecting

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vapors off of the, the, the
heated up chemicals UPS, you

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know, down down hole.
So I'm assuming there's some

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sort of a SVE system soil vapor
extraction component to the a

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combination type component to
the delivery.

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Is that is that accurate?
Yeah, absolutely.

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Any one of our thermal treatment
systems, regardless of whether

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it's thermal conduction, heating
or electrical resistance or

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steam would always have a soil
vapor extraction system because

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we need to capture, maintain
pneumatic control, capture the

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the steam that we're generating
from heating up the subsurface,

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the contaminant vapors that are
coming off.

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And you know, we need to
maintain capture and control of

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that.
And then occasionally you

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depending on the site and what's
going on with the hydrogeology,

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we would often also integrate
some form of hydraulic control

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as well.
So that might be pumping wells

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or multi phase extraction wells
within the the footprint of the

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treatment zone to make sure that
we also maintain a hydraulic

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control and inward hydraulic
gradient during our thermal

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treatment operation.
So it sounds like the

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hydrogeology has got to be
really well understood to really

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deploy a proper system.
Yeah, absolutely.

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I think that's, that's one of
the keys for, you know, a good

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thermal design for us to do a
good job with the thermal design

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is it's imperative that the, the
consultants have a good site

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conceptual model that they
really understand very well the,

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the site characterization.
So all the, the site geology,

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hydrogeology, you know, the, the
physical geometry of the site

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plume, because it doesn't, you
know, it doesn't necessarily

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have to be a straight column.
It could be oddly shaped.

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And we can, we can tune our
heating system to deal with, you

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know, layered plumes or things
like that.

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But it's it's really important
to have that solid site

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conceptual model as the
foundation of the thermal design

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to make sure that we can
effectively heat the site, treat

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it and capture all of the the
contaminants coming off.

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So when consultants come to you
curious, which types of I guess

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projects do you I guess
gravitate towards or have more

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excitement about when they're
when they're brought to you?

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A site that has a 3D model
already built up and you know,

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has a visual understanding of
really what's happening or a lot

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of 2D drawings that you know,
interpret.

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What would they think are, are
the, you know, the full picture

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of the subsurface hydrogeology?
What seems to be a better

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representation for you guys to
really zero in?

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I think either is fine.
You know, having a a nice, very

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detailed 3D model is great as
long as you know the consultant

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and we are comfortable that that
the data went into building that

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3D model is, is good.
You know, there's a lot of

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interpolation and extrapolation
and the lines are yeah.

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Then I think it's so it given
the choice if I'd rather have

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00:12:01,680 --> 00:12:04,480
the most accurate data that's
possible, whether that's

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available in in in a 3D format.
And that's fantastic because

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then we can really do a good job
visualizing the plume and, and

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our design around that.
But if the data that's available

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is, you know, good solid 2D
data, we can, we can work with

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that.
You can.

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Work with that too.
Yeah.

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OK, That's good.
All right, That's fair.

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That's fair.
Hello ET Nation, I want to thank

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00:12:24,480 --> 00:12:26,080
you for listening to the
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If you enjoy the interviews
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visiting my website.

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00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:34,520
At Sean K Grady dot.
Com and buy me a cup of coffee

227
00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:37,720
proceeds will go towards helping
me continue producing timely

228
00:12:37,720 --> 00:12:39,960
content and offsetting
production costs.

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00:12:40,640 --> 00:12:42,880
I'd also like to take a moment
and recognize a few of our

230
00:12:42,880 --> 00:12:46,720
sponsors of the show who have
been amazing partners and who

231
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are ET Nation legends.
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240
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242
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at cascade-env.com.

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00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:24,440
That's Cascade dash env dot.
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244
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shout out to.
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Analytical, visit
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255
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That's enthalpy.com.
Finally, I'd like to recognize

256
00:13:57,480 --> 00:14:00,640
Zappa Stewart, the leading
provider of super absorbent

257
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264
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Stewart, go to
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265
00:14:26,600 --> 00:14:30,520
That's Sean K grady.com.
Now, let's dive back into this

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00:14:30,520 --> 00:14:32,360
interview.
You know, often, you know, a lot

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00:14:32,360 --> 00:14:34,720
of clients, they're really
trying to figure out what they

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00:14:34,720 --> 00:14:38,520
should do as far as the the type
of remedial solution they should

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00:14:38,520 --> 00:14:40,760
select.
You know, what are some of the

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00:14:40,760 --> 00:14:44,320
drivers that you know our
clients are evaluating, you

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00:14:44,320 --> 00:14:47,840
know, when they decide to select
a thermal treatment versus some

272
00:14:47,840 --> 00:14:50,960
other traditional remedial like
in situ chemical type

273
00:14:51,160 --> 00:14:53,760
treatments?
Yeah, I had some of some of the

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00:14:53,760 --> 00:14:55,320
things we talked about
previously.

275
00:14:55,320 --> 00:14:59,480
So you know, obviously there's
always a budget component and a

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00:14:59,480 --> 00:15:02,320
time component to things.
But I think really when you're

277
00:15:02,320 --> 00:15:05,960
looking at thermal technology as
part of your remediation

278
00:15:05,960 --> 00:15:09,080
alternative evaluation, first
you got to make sure it's

279
00:15:09,080 --> 00:15:11,120
applicable.
So it's it's a site conceptual

280
00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:13,240
model of geology and
hydrogeology.

281
00:15:13,720 --> 00:15:16,400
What contaminants are present
and what your cleanup goals are.

282
00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:19,640
You know, are you just looking
for to maximize mass removal to

283
00:15:19,640 --> 00:15:22,360
get rid of Dean apple or ELN
apple, you know, floating or

284
00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:25,200
sinking product or are you
trying to get down to very low

285
00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:27,520
concentrations?
Thermal can accomplish any of

286
00:15:27,520 --> 00:15:29,520
those.
So it's a matter of what, you

287
00:15:29,520 --> 00:15:31,080
know, ultimately what your goals
are.

288
00:15:31,600 --> 00:15:34,120
We talked about earlier, you
know, depth really isn't a

289
00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:37,040
factor for thermal treatment
technology, but if it's if it's

290
00:15:37,040 --> 00:15:40,520
very shallow, you know, 5 feet
deep, something you can easily

291
00:15:40,520 --> 00:15:44,840
excavate might be easier to just
do that.

292
00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:48,720
Certainly, you know, 3050 sixty
feet.

293
00:15:49,040 --> 00:15:53,120
We do that every day.
So, you know, I think, and then

294
00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:56,840
any, like we talked about any
potential obstructions or, you

295
00:15:56,840 --> 00:15:59,360
know, physical barriers in the
treatment zone, if there's a,

296
00:15:59,560 --> 00:16:02,240
you know, an important building
or some piece of infrastructure

297
00:16:02,240 --> 00:16:04,720
that needs to be preserved where
you can't, you know, knock down

298
00:16:04,720 --> 00:16:06,920
the building and dig around it,
we can thermally treat

299
00:16:06,920 --> 00:16:08,960
underneath it.
You know, and like I said,

300
00:16:08,960 --> 00:16:12,240
timeline, I think one of the
things you know, that you need

301
00:16:12,240 --> 00:16:15,400
to think about when you're
evaluating thermal treatment is

302
00:16:15,520 --> 00:16:19,560
the, the life cycle cost.
You know, if you have a thermal

303
00:16:19,560 --> 00:16:22,880
treatment site, you're going to
be in and out of the site in 12

304
00:16:22,880 --> 00:16:25,200
or 18 months.
You're going to have, you know,

305
00:16:25,200 --> 00:16:29,160
very good contaminant removal,
low concentrations and, and be

306
00:16:29,160 --> 00:16:31,560
able to move on with the site to
do whatever else you need to do

307
00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:35,000
with it, to redevelop or, or
sell it or whatever it may be.

308
00:16:35,280 --> 00:16:39,320
Meet a regulatory requirement.
Versus like a chemical oxidation

309
00:16:39,320 --> 00:16:42,160
where you know, you do an
injection and you treat the

310
00:16:42,160 --> 00:16:45,680
certain area, you may have to go
back and retreat residual areas

311
00:16:45,680 --> 00:16:48,880
and and it may require several
rounds of retreatment for a

312
00:16:48,880 --> 00:16:51,720
couple of years.
So I think when you're looking

313
00:16:51,720 --> 00:16:54,800
at thermal technology, you got
to look at the the life cycle

314
00:16:54,800 --> 00:16:56,680
cost.
It might be a little bit more

315
00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:00,640
upfront, but if you look at you
know three or five years or 10

316
00:17:00,640 --> 00:17:04,960
years of chemical treatment or
50 years, 100 years of pumping

317
00:17:04,960 --> 00:17:07,599
and treatment for containment, I
think thermal treatment comes

318
00:17:07,599 --> 00:17:10,839
out generally, you know
favorable for some of these high

319
00:17:10,839 --> 00:17:13,359
mass source cells.
That's really good.

320
00:17:13,359 --> 00:17:15,760
That's good to kind of
understand, you know, some of

321
00:17:15,760 --> 00:17:17,920
the I guess considerations
there.

322
00:17:17,920 --> 00:17:23,040
What about you know, utility
infrastructure that's needed

323
00:17:23,040 --> 00:17:26,880
from, you know, I guess a power,
I mean you guys need a lot of

324
00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:28,880
power to run these systems,
don't you?

325
00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:33,640
So are you having arrangements
with local utilities to or are

326
00:17:33,640 --> 00:17:37,440
these things stand alone units
or how does that work for

327
00:17:37,880 --> 00:17:40,200
considering you know the
deployment of these solutions?

328
00:17:41,160 --> 00:17:43,840
Yeah, it depends on the site.
In some cases, you know, we've,

329
00:17:43,880 --> 00:17:47,480
we've worked at active chemical
plants or, or military bases

330
00:17:47,480 --> 00:17:51,400
where there's plenty of power
there on the site and all we do

331
00:17:51,400 --> 00:17:53,880
is, you know, drop our
transformer or power control

332
00:17:53,880 --> 00:17:57,520
units and, and hook up to it.
In other cases, you know, maybe

333
00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:00,920
a, a site that's been out of
service or you know, just

334
00:18:00,920 --> 00:18:03,160
doesn't have the power
infrastructure in the area.

335
00:18:03,560 --> 00:18:07,120
And we, either we or the
consultant would coordinate with

336
00:18:07,120 --> 00:18:10,400
the local power utility to bring
power to the site.

337
00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,120
You know, and that could take,
depending on the, the amount of

338
00:18:14,120 --> 00:18:18,200
power demanded, could be a few
months to, you know, six months

339
00:18:18,200 --> 00:18:21,520
or more, depending on what the
utility company has available in

340
00:18:21,520 --> 00:18:24,920
the area.
But ideally that's part of, you

341
00:18:24,920 --> 00:18:28,240
know, part of our early design
and planning process.

342
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:31,120
And then like I said, either we
are the consultant, we take that

343
00:18:31,400 --> 00:18:34,280
preliminary design information,
get that to the utility as early

344
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:37,720
as possible so that we can start
that process of getting the

345
00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,600
getting the service there.
But you know, in a lot of cases,

346
00:18:40,600 --> 00:18:44,160
particularly sites that we're
treating our, our old industrial

347
00:18:44,160 --> 00:18:46,640
sites, there's generally power
available.

348
00:18:46,640 --> 00:18:50,320
It may not be at the site
anymore, but getting it brought

349
00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:52,000
to the site is usually fairly
quick.

350
00:18:52,960 --> 00:18:53,840
OK.
Well, that's a good

351
00:18:53,840 --> 00:18:57,160
consideration to factor into the
the the approach and the

352
00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:01,200
schedule, right?
It is and we've seen some, some

353
00:19:01,200 --> 00:19:04,480
clients, you know, we did a, a
project down at the Solvent

354
00:19:04,480 --> 00:19:08,480
Recovery Systems of New England
Superfund site where the client

355
00:19:08,480 --> 00:19:12,040
actually bought a large block of
power at essentially at a

356
00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:14,800
wholesale cost.
You know, so there's, they were

357
00:19:14,800 --> 00:19:18,840
able to, based on our design,
know how much power was going to

358
00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:21,320
be needed for the project when
we were going to be done and

359
00:19:21,320 --> 00:19:24,440
ready and they were able to get
that power at a discounted rate.

360
00:19:24,920 --> 00:19:27,160
There's, you know, there's pros
and cons to doing that because

361
00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:29,680
you've got a, it's a fixed
amount of power for a fixed

362
00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:32,680
period of time.
But you know, if you can for a

363
00:19:32,680 --> 00:19:35,320
site like that, that was a a
pretty big site that had a

364
00:19:35,520 --> 00:19:38,920
pretty big power spend, you
know, it was worth doing that

365
00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:42,840
and buying 75 or 80% of the
estimated power that was going

366
00:19:42,840 --> 00:19:46,320
to be used at that wholesale
price and then just dealing with

367
00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:48,720
the the final bit at market
rate.

368
00:19:49,160 --> 00:19:51,000
That's interesting.
That's a, that's a kind of a

369
00:19:51,000 --> 00:19:54,600
good strategy and and that's
good proper planning ahead of

370
00:19:54,600 --> 00:19:58,080
time to to, you know, prepare
for a sizable remediation

371
00:19:58,080 --> 00:19:59,080
project.
That's really good.

372
00:19:59,120 --> 00:20:02,280
I'm glad you daylighted that
option or that, you know,

373
00:20:02,600 --> 00:20:05,400
activity that took place to for
that big project.

374
00:20:05,400 --> 00:20:07,040
That's really good.
I mean, because there's probably

375
00:20:07,040 --> 00:20:09,480
like all kinds of those like
little things that you don't

376
00:20:09,480 --> 00:20:12,560
know or think about when you're
trying to deploy a solution like

377
00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:13,920
this.
Yeah.

378
00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:16,840
I mean we've seen you know,
particularly out in California

379
00:20:16,840 --> 00:20:20,600
where you know power is in high
demand and and fairly expensive.

380
00:20:20,600 --> 00:20:23,680
We've done, we've done some
projects there where the project

381
00:20:23,840 --> 00:20:28,400
electrical was had had a peak
rate and a non peak rate or peak

382
00:20:28,400 --> 00:20:30,480
and off peak rates throughout
the day.

383
00:20:30,840 --> 00:20:34,080
So we timed our heating and we
would ramp down our heaters

384
00:20:34,080 --> 00:20:37,720
during the on peak period to
minimize power cost and demand

385
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:41,080
on the grid and then ramp back
up during the the off peak times

386
00:20:41,080 --> 00:20:42,560
of the day.
So we were able to cycle our

387
00:20:42,560 --> 00:20:46,440
heaters up and down, save cost
for the client on on the power

388
00:20:46,440 --> 00:20:51,160
side and minimize the the demand
on the grid during the busiest

389
00:20:51,280 --> 00:20:53,640
periods of the day.
So there's lots of things that

390
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:56,360
we can do, you know, as part of
the planning and part of the

391
00:20:56,360 --> 00:20:58,280
design.
And you know, I think that's

392
00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:01,480
that's where we shine, working
with the in a collaborative

393
00:21:01,480 --> 00:21:04,040
manner with the consultants and
the owners to be able to come up

394
00:21:04,040 --> 00:21:07,240
with strategies like that to
help, you know, them achieve

395
00:21:07,240 --> 00:21:10,600
their objectives and their
remediation goals at at the most

396
00:21:10,600 --> 00:21:12,960
reasonable price that they can.
Yeah.

397
00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:15,480
I mean, that's what you call a
partner, you know, right.

398
00:21:15,880 --> 00:21:18,720
That's where you come in, you're
part of the team and you partner

399
00:21:18,720 --> 00:21:20,120
and you really come up with the
strategy.

400
00:21:20,120 --> 00:21:23,200
That's that's really great.
I love that example, you know, a

401
00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:26,040
lot of guys and you know, who've
been around the business of

402
00:21:26,040 --> 00:21:29,160
doing cleanups and site
remediation for years and years.

403
00:21:29,160 --> 00:21:32,440
You know, that they've, they've
either got some biases or, you

404
00:21:32,440 --> 00:21:35,960
know, some of their own, I guess
go to strategies for

405
00:21:35,960 --> 00:21:39,320
remediating, you know,
chlorinate solvent sites out

406
00:21:39,320 --> 00:21:42,400
there and, and whether you know,
proven or not.

407
00:21:42,400 --> 00:21:46,640
And, and, you know, I think
early on and in my experience

408
00:21:46,640 --> 00:21:50,040
is, you know, early on thermal
treatment was, you know, viewed

409
00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:54,400
as extremely expensive and, and,
and you know, capital, you know,

410
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:58,240
intense.
So it wasn't really a big

411
00:21:58,240 --> 00:22:01,280
appetite for it initially, you
know, when it first was kind of

412
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:05,000
coming into the market as a, as
a really good alternative unless

413
00:22:05,000 --> 00:22:08,840
you were working for say, the
military, who would would really

414
00:22:08,840 --> 00:22:10,480
kind of fund these things.
We.

415
00:22:10,480 --> 00:22:12,000
We would.
Really kind of have some.

416
00:22:12,000 --> 00:22:13,840
Hesitation.
So what?

417
00:22:13,840 --> 00:22:16,640
I was hoping to do with you is
play a little bit of this, you

418
00:22:16,640 --> 00:22:21,640
know, let's debunk the myth here
because, you know, I feel like,

419
00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:23,440
you know, there's a lot of.
You know you can.

420
00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:26,440
Teach an old dog new tricks kind
of concepts here.

421
00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:28,240
And I think there's a lot of,
you know, listeners.

422
00:22:28,240 --> 00:22:31,440
Who really do?
Want to find the best solution

423
00:22:31,440 --> 00:22:34,280
for their clients and, and you
know, thermal treatment might be

424
00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:36,720
the best 1.
And so I want to give you an

425
00:22:36,720 --> 00:22:39,920
opportunity to kind of walk
through and maybe debunk some of

426
00:22:39,920 --> 00:22:42,560
these myths and let's talk about
it and what, you know, let's let

427
00:22:42,560 --> 00:22:47,000
the listeners, you know, know.
So myth #1 thermal.

428
00:22:47,000 --> 00:22:51,960
Conducting heating TCH is
ineffective below the water

429
00:22:51,960 --> 00:22:54,560
table.
Yeah, I would say that's false.

430
00:22:55,680 --> 00:22:58,760
But you know, I think it's, it's
like everything else, it's, it's

431
00:22:58,760 --> 00:23:02,480
a design consideration.
So we've done a ton of sites

432
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:06,200
with TCH treating contaminants
to the very low concentrations

433
00:23:06,560 --> 00:23:09,280
below the water table.
I would say that, you know,

434
00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:12,280
anytime you're treating a
contaminant below the water

435
00:23:12,280 --> 00:23:15,000
table, it's really going to end
up having to be something that

436
00:23:15,000 --> 00:23:18,760
could could be treated
effectively at 100° C, the

437
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:21,440
boiling point of water or
slightly higher if you've got a

438
00:23:21,440 --> 00:23:23,960
big hydrostatic head from the
water table above.

439
00:23:23,960 --> 00:23:27,120
But essentially, so that would
include, you know, all of your

440
00:23:27,120 --> 00:23:30,760
BTEX gasoline, jet fuel, you
know, a lot of chlorinated

441
00:23:30,760 --> 00:23:34,200
solvents, PCETCE, those types of
compounds.

442
00:23:34,720 --> 00:23:38,040
And yeah, they can be treated in
within the saturated zone under

443
00:23:38,040 --> 00:23:42,440
the water, but moving water can
move a lot of Btus.

444
00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:45,160
It can, it can carry away a lot
of energy and a lot of the heat.

445
00:23:45,160 --> 00:23:49,200
So we typically look at, you
know, if the groundwater flux

446
00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:54,840
rate is in less than half a foot
per day to as much as a foot per

447
00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:59,040
day, it's a good candidate site
for thermal remediation, you

448
00:23:59,040 --> 00:24:03,440
know, by by ERH or TCH.
So if it's if it's more than

449
00:24:03,440 --> 00:24:05,760
that or moving up toward the
higher end of that range, we

450
00:24:05,760 --> 00:24:08,960
would look at some design
considerations to address the

451
00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:12,080
site specific water flow.
You know, might be something as

452
00:24:12,080 --> 00:24:15,240
simple as just tightening up our
heater or electrode spacing on

453
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:19,320
the on the upgrading side of the
well field or tightening our

454
00:24:19,440 --> 00:24:21,840
heater spacing within the entire
well field.

455
00:24:22,280 --> 00:24:25,760
As we, you know, move up to a
little bit more water flow, you

456
00:24:25,760 --> 00:24:28,680
know, we would add pumping
wells, extraction wells along

457
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:31,680
the upgrading edge or multi
phase extraction wells in the

458
00:24:31,680 --> 00:24:35,360
treatment zone.
If you start getting a lot above

459
00:24:35,360 --> 00:24:38,040
that, above that one foot per
day, then you have to look at

460
00:24:38,120 --> 00:24:41,800
probably more conventional
hydraulic control, you know, so

461
00:24:41,960 --> 00:24:43,600
sheet pile wall or something
like that.

462
00:24:43,600 --> 00:24:46,760
And we've done a number of
projects, in fact a large one

463
00:24:46,760 --> 00:24:49,680
that's going on right now in
upstate New York where the

464
00:24:49,680 --> 00:24:52,920
treatment zone is surrounded by
sheet pile wall that's keyed

465
00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:57,160
into a low permeability barrier.
You know, steam enhanced

466
00:24:57,160 --> 00:25:00,200
remediation though that's,
that's pretty well suited for

467
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,760
sandy and gravelly conditions.
And you know, we can, we can do

468
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:08,080
steam remediation for compounds
at at, you know, with much

469
00:25:08,080 --> 00:25:10,200
higher groundwater flux
velocities.

470
00:25:10,680 --> 00:25:16,000
OK, all right, well here's myth
#2 electrical resisted heating

471
00:25:16,040 --> 00:25:20,720
ERH doesn't work in dry soils
above the water table.

472
00:25:22,200 --> 00:25:24,920
No, I would, I would say that's
also false as well.

473
00:25:24,920 --> 00:25:27,760
So electrical resistance
heating, like we talked about

474
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:32,120
it, it's pushing electricity
between two electrodes and it's

475
00:25:32,240 --> 00:25:36,360
pushing through the soil medium.
The resistance of the soil to

476
00:25:36,360 --> 00:25:38,320
the current flow is what
generates the heat.

477
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:42,800
But it does rely on the presence
of soil moisture to allow that

478
00:25:42,960 --> 00:25:46,920
electrical conduction, right.
So dry soil, the, the electrical

479
00:25:46,920 --> 00:25:49,360
current isn't going to flow as
long as there's some moisture in

480
00:25:49,360 --> 00:25:53,360
the soil, even if it's the, you
know, residual moist moisture in

481
00:25:53,360 --> 00:25:55,640
the beta zone, the current can
still flow.

482
00:25:56,160 --> 00:25:59,960
But in, in cases like that where
we're above the water table or

483
00:25:59,960 --> 00:26:03,440
where it's dry or, or not
recharging and tending to dry

484
00:26:03,440 --> 00:26:07,960
out, we would probably integrate
drip system so that we can drip

485
00:26:07,960 --> 00:26:11,960
water in at the electrodes so
that we, we maintain moisture.

486
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,720
We what we don't want to happen
is have the soil immediately

487
00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:19,040
around the electrode dry out and
then we can't push the current

488
00:26:19,040 --> 00:26:23,280
out to the surrounding soil.
So we drip water into the elect,

489
00:26:23,520 --> 00:26:27,720
the electrode into the the
annual packing material and that

490
00:26:27,720 --> 00:26:30,320
way we keep it moist and
maintain good conduct

491
00:26:30,320 --> 00:26:32,080
conductivity with the
surrounding soil.

492
00:26:32,520 --> 00:26:34,080
OK.
So you kind of Lube it up a

493
00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:37,080
little bit and keep her, keep
her wet, Yeah.

494
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:41,120
So it's, it's possible it just,
you know, requires again goes

495
00:26:41,120 --> 00:26:43,640
back to what I said earlier,
having a good site conceptual

496
00:26:43,640 --> 00:26:47,680
model and knowing what your
geologic conditions are, we can

497
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,000
design for it to make sure that
it works effectively.

498
00:26:50,320 --> 00:26:51,800
All right, all right, that's
good.

499
00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:54,480
That's good.
All right, here's myth #3

500
00:26:54,800 --> 00:26:57,560
Thermal.
Remediation is prohibitively.

501
00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,560
Expensive compared to other
methods.

502
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:06,360
Heck no, Yeah, no, I mean it's
as I said, you know, you're

503
00:27:06,360 --> 00:27:08,640
going to you're going to think
of it on a life cycle cost

504
00:27:08,640 --> 00:27:11,400
basis, you know, So it's not
necessarily cheap.

505
00:27:11,560 --> 00:27:16,040
On the other hand, I would say,
you know, for most CBOC or BTEX

506
00:27:16,040 --> 00:27:19,640
type, you know, lighter weight
petroleum hydrocarbon sites, we

507
00:27:19,760 --> 00:27:24,080
we could probably be in the 100
to $200 cubic yard range for for

508
00:27:24,600 --> 00:27:28,480
large sites, you know, big, big
volume, we've been probably as

509
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:32,440
cheap as in the mid seventies,
$70 per cubic yard range.

510
00:27:32,840 --> 00:27:35,800
Obviously for, you know, some of
the more complex or higher

511
00:27:35,800 --> 00:27:39,440
boiling compounds, the cost
might be a little bit more.

512
00:27:39,800 --> 00:27:45,200
But I think when you look at
being able to achieve very low

513
00:27:45,200 --> 00:27:49,120
concentration goals reliably and
quickly, you know there's a

514
00:27:49,120 --> 00:27:51,520
value to that.
Well, what is like the

515
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:54,880
destruction rate and and I guess
effectiveness?

516
00:27:54,880 --> 00:27:57,680
So, you know, from the the mass
destruction, we didn't, we

517
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,640
didn't cover that really
previously in our conversation.

518
00:28:00,640 --> 00:28:03,400
But you're you're, you're
talking about these costs and

519
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:05,120
life cycle.
And, you know, if I'm going to

520
00:28:05,120 --> 00:28:07,920
make a decision to say I was a
client and I was going to make a

521
00:28:07,920 --> 00:28:10,080
decision to go with you guys,
I'd be I want some more

522
00:28:10,080 --> 00:28:12,680
certainty that, yeah, you're
going to really be able to knock

523
00:28:12,680 --> 00:28:16,200
some, you know, the mass out in,
in a relatively quick period of

524
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:18,080
time.
You know, talk a little bit

525
00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:20,120
about, you know, that
effectiveness.

526
00:28:21,200 --> 00:28:22,960
Yeah.
We see a range of different

527
00:28:23,040 --> 00:28:26,360
conditions in our contract, but
I virtually every contract we

528
00:28:26,360 --> 00:28:28,800
have has some sort of a
performance guarantee in it.

529
00:28:29,360 --> 00:28:32,880
And in some cases that, you
know, that may be, you know, a

530
00:28:32,880 --> 00:28:35,680
site, military site or an
industrial site that's, that's

531
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:37,280
going to remain that way for
years.

532
00:28:37,640 --> 00:28:41,080
And their goal is just mass
removal, get out, get out all of

533
00:28:41,080 --> 00:28:43,880
the mobile Dean Apple and
whatever else comes with it.

534
00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:47,200
And you know, we'll, we'll
monitor the data and tell you

535
00:28:47,200 --> 00:28:49,680
when we're done.
So kind of just kind of a, you

536
00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:51,320
know, mass mass removal type
goal.

537
00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:54,960
In other cases we have in most
cases, I would say we have

538
00:28:54,960 --> 00:28:59,400
specific goals with regard to,
you know, achieving temperature

539
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:02,920
in the target treatment zone as
well as post treatment

540
00:29:02,920 --> 00:29:06,840
concentrations in soil and and
occasionally in groundwater.

541
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,960
So you know, we're, we're
generally for, for chlorinated

542
00:29:09,960 --> 00:29:13,160
solvent compounds, we're
generally down less than one

543
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,840
part per million.
Is is kind of frequent goals

544
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:19,120
less than less than 5 less than
one, you know, four.

545
00:29:19,120 --> 00:29:23,240
We did a large dioxin treatment
project over in Vietnam where

546
00:29:23,240 --> 00:29:26,400
our goals were down in the
single digit part per billion,

547
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:30,800
the part per trillion range.
So, you know, and that's when

548
00:29:30,800 --> 00:29:32,840
you're talking about, you know,
PFAS compounds.

549
00:29:32,840 --> 00:29:35,480
I think we'll we'll start to see
treatment goals.

550
00:29:35,480 --> 00:29:37,920
They haven't been set yet for
soil, but I think we'll start to

551
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:42,120
see soil treatment goals for for
PFAS compounds probably down in

552
00:29:42,120 --> 00:29:43,960
that low part per trillion range
as well.

553
00:29:44,880 --> 00:29:47,120
Wow.
Yeah, yeah, that's that's crazy.

554
00:29:47,240 --> 00:29:50,520
OK, here's another myth for us,
thermal methods are only

555
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:53,480
suitable for specific soil types
or contaminants.

556
00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:56,400
Yeah.
No, I think it's we've kind of

557
00:29:56,400 --> 00:30:02,280
touched on that earlier.
The the site geology and the

558
00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:04,440
contaminants and the clean up
goals are what drive the

559
00:30:04,440 --> 00:30:07,520
selection of the appropriate
thermal technology.

560
00:30:07,840 --> 00:30:11,000
So you know chlorinated
solvents, BTEX compounds were

561
00:30:11,000 --> 00:30:15,040
probably in a silt and clay.
We're probably looking at TCH or

562
00:30:15,120 --> 00:30:19,240
ERH and we would do some design
evaluation to decide which is

563
00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:23,480
going to be the most appropriate
those same compounds in you know

564
00:30:24,000 --> 00:30:26,120
very sandy aquifer with high
flow rates.

565
00:30:26,120 --> 00:30:28,000
We would look at a steam
solution.

566
00:30:28,960 --> 00:30:32,880
We did a, we did a project up in
the Washington State last couple

567
00:30:32,880 --> 00:30:37,360
years ago where it was, it was
just layered sort of a sandy

568
00:30:37,360 --> 00:30:40,040
zone with layers of silt and
clay.

569
00:30:40,040 --> 00:30:42,520
So we did a combination of ERH
and steam.

570
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,800
So really the the it's the
geology and the contaminants and

571
00:30:47,800 --> 00:30:49,720
the and the goals that drive the
selection.

572
00:30:50,080 --> 00:30:52,520
But there's not really any
contaminants that you can't

573
00:30:53,040 --> 00:30:55,360
treat.
Is that is that fair?

574
00:30:55,880 --> 00:30:58,440
Yeah, I would say probably no
organic contaminants.

575
00:30:58,440 --> 00:31:00,960
You know, so thermal treatment
is really it's, it's

576
00:31:01,400 --> 00:31:04,000
particularly focused on organic
contaminants.

577
00:31:04,000 --> 00:31:07,240
We really can't use it for
treating Chrome or lead or

578
00:31:07,240 --> 00:31:09,520
something like that.
It has been used and

579
00:31:09,520 --> 00:31:13,000
demonstrated to be able to treat
mercury because we can, we can

580
00:31:13,000 --> 00:31:15,640
get hot enough that we can boil
off the mercury with, with the

581
00:31:15,640 --> 00:31:19,320
TCH solution and then, you know,
condense it out through a retort

582
00:31:19,320 --> 00:31:22,400
or something like that.
But mainly it's focused on

583
00:31:22,400 --> 00:31:25,000
organic contaminants.
Gotcha, gotcha.

584
00:31:25,000 --> 00:31:26,440
OK, fair enough.
Good, good.

585
00:31:27,360 --> 00:31:33,240
Last question #5 Fifth, you know
thermal remediation causes

586
00:31:33,240 --> 00:31:35,920
irreversible damage to soil
properties.

587
00:31:36,960 --> 00:31:39,520
No, definitely not.
I think we've got, we've got a

588
00:31:39,520 --> 00:31:43,040
number of cases where we've
shown that in fact a very strong

589
00:31:43,040 --> 00:31:46,040
benefit to the to the subsurface
environment.

590
00:31:46,040 --> 00:31:49,920
So definitely during heating,
you know, the earthworms

591
00:31:49,920 --> 00:31:52,560
probably don't like it there.
Some of the, some of the native

592
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:55,880
microbes may die off during
thermal heating, particularly in

593
00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,280
a high temperature scenario
where we're going well above the

594
00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:02,200
boiling point of water.
But typically, you know, just

595
00:32:02,200 --> 00:32:06,400
through natural rainwater after
the end of thermal treatment

596
00:32:06,440 --> 00:32:10,640
and, and recharge that sort of
the, the microbial community

597
00:32:10,640 --> 00:32:13,120
comes back.
And that project that I

598
00:32:13,120 --> 00:32:16,320
mentioned in Washington state
had a had a downgrading

599
00:32:16,320 --> 00:32:20,320
component where there was a some
down grading and bioremediation

600
00:32:20,320 --> 00:32:23,880
injections and they got the
benefit of this sort of warm

601
00:32:23,880 --> 00:32:25,600
plume.
When we release the hydraulic

602
00:32:25,600 --> 00:32:28,440
control from the thermal zone,
they had all this nice warm

603
00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,960
groundwater that flowed through
the down gradient zone and

604
00:32:31,960 --> 00:32:34,880
actually promoted the enhanced
bioremediation.

605
00:32:34,960 --> 00:32:38,960
So it's another, it's kind of
another Ave. that another market

606
00:32:38,960 --> 00:32:41,040
area that we're looking at for
thermal remediation.

607
00:32:41,040 --> 00:32:44,240
We've done a number of lower
temperature projects where we're

608
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:48,960
using lower powered thermal
remediation to encourage

609
00:32:49,280 --> 00:32:52,200
thermally enhanced
bioremediation or even thermally

610
00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:55,200
enhanced hydrolysis at
temperatures below the boiling

611
00:32:55,200 --> 00:32:58,160
point of water.
Wow, that's great.

612
00:32:58,160 --> 00:33:00,280
That's really good.
I mean that's, that's thinking

613
00:33:00,280 --> 00:33:03,480
outside the box there to kind of
create additional remedial

614
00:33:03,480 --> 00:33:06,960
solutions to, to address these,
these contaminants.

615
00:33:06,960 --> 00:33:11,400
I love it.
Well, I think we went through 5

616
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:12,560
myths.
That's pretty good.

617
00:33:12,560 --> 00:33:14,440
You answered them pretty well
there, Jim.

618
00:33:14,440 --> 00:33:16,600
Appreciate that.
I think a lot of, you know,

619
00:33:17,680 --> 00:33:21,160
minds can, you know, thought,
thinking guys, we're going let

620
00:33:21,200 --> 00:33:23,080
me think about this.
And these are some of the

621
00:33:23,080 --> 00:33:25,800
challenges I've experienced or
heard of and I'm glad we just

622
00:33:25,800 --> 00:33:27,720
debunked all those myths.
So good job.

623
00:33:28,640 --> 00:33:30,280
All right, here's a question for
you.

624
00:33:30,280 --> 00:33:33,400
What type of information do you
need to properly design A

625
00:33:33,400 --> 00:33:35,640
thermal treatment system?
We've been talking a little bit

626
00:33:35,640 --> 00:33:38,600
about, you know, some of the
things, but maybe you could run

627
00:33:38,600 --> 00:33:42,760
down a real good high level list
of some of the things that you

628
00:33:42,760 --> 00:33:45,840
know, you're like, I need this
or we can't move forward.

629
00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:48,800
Or if you don't give me this,
you're getting an incomplete

630
00:33:48,800 --> 00:33:51,840
cost estimate or, you know, give
me some of those details.

631
00:33:51,840 --> 00:33:55,720
So if I am a consultant
listening to this, they're going

632
00:33:55,720 --> 00:33:59,440
to know I need to have these
elements to with me when I go

633
00:33:59,440 --> 00:34:03,400
talk to Jim.
Yeah, I think, I think like I

634
00:34:03,400 --> 00:34:06,560
said earlier, the just a good
accurate site characterization

635
00:34:06,560 --> 00:34:09,760
site conceptual model is key.
So really having having good

636
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:13,440
solid information on the the
site geology, the hydrogeology

637
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:15,320
and and a well defined treatment
zone.

638
00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:19,199
So ideally we would like the
consultant to tell us what, what

639
00:34:19,199 --> 00:34:22,199
box do you want us to treat and
then what's in the box.

640
00:34:22,199 --> 00:34:25,639
So the geology, the
hydrogeology, you, you know,

641
00:34:25,639 --> 00:34:28,760
depth of water, information
about the contaminants that are

642
00:34:28,760 --> 00:34:31,360
there that you know, your target
contaminants as well as any

643
00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:35,639
other maybe less significant or
non target contaminants.

644
00:34:36,199 --> 00:34:40,080
You know, I think any, any
additional information, you

645
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:43,199
know, if we're looking at an ERH
solution, we'd ideally like to

646
00:34:43,199 --> 00:34:47,280
get some electrical resistivity
properties of the, of the soil.

647
00:34:47,320 --> 00:34:50,560
That's probably not as, as
common in, you know, a typical

648
00:34:50,639 --> 00:34:53,679
site investigation.
It's important for us just to

649
00:34:53,679 --> 00:34:57,520
know what the regulatory goals
are, what the, the client and

650
00:34:57,520 --> 00:35:00,680
owners commitments are to, you
know, to the regulators, what

651
00:35:00,680 --> 00:35:03,560
their timeline is and, and of
course what the budget is.

652
00:35:04,080 --> 00:35:08,280
And then just, it's always
helpful for us to get a, a good

653
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:10,560
site map.
So I ideally, you know, in an

654
00:35:10,560 --> 00:35:12,520
AutoCAD drawing format or
something like that.

655
00:35:12,520 --> 00:35:15,840
So we use that as our base map
and we can overlay our design on

656
00:35:15,840 --> 00:35:19,240
top of that.
Any, any of the other useful

657
00:35:19,760 --> 00:35:23,360
existing conditions information.
So you know, site topography,

658
00:35:23,680 --> 00:35:27,240
any site features, buildings,
utilities and as much, much

659
00:35:27,240 --> 00:35:29,440
information as you can tell us
about what's in the treatment

660
00:35:29,440 --> 00:35:31,800
zone as possible.
And we have, we have a

661
00:35:31,800 --> 00:35:34,280
questionnaire on our website or
that, you know that we can

662
00:35:34,280 --> 00:35:37,360
provide that that kind of
gathers all of that information.

663
00:35:37,680 --> 00:35:38,600
Perfect.
So yeah.

664
00:35:39,760 --> 00:35:41,080
That's great.
That's that's real good.

665
00:35:41,080 --> 00:35:42,160
Yeah.
You got to know, you know, you

666
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:45,480
need to know the information
before you can provide a good,

667
00:35:45,560 --> 00:35:48,800
you know, design and a cost
estimate and, and how long you

668
00:35:48,800 --> 00:35:51,720
need to run these things.
And yeah, that's, that's good to

669
00:35:51,720 --> 00:35:54,960
know.
So well, how does someone get

670
00:35:54,960 --> 00:35:58,360
ahold of you guys if they want
to reach out and Jim, and they

671
00:35:58,360 --> 00:36:00,000
say, hey, I've been listening to
this podcast.

672
00:36:00,000 --> 00:36:03,000
This is a great opportunity for
me to get some more Intel on the

673
00:36:03,000 --> 00:36:06,680
Terra therm and, and the, the
types of solutions you can offer

674
00:36:06,680 --> 00:36:09,320
to address some of the
remediation challenges I have at

675
00:36:09,320 --> 00:36:11,080
my project.
What's the best way to get ahold

676
00:36:11,080 --> 00:36:13,520
of you, Jim?
Well, I think, you know,

677
00:36:13,520 --> 00:36:16,320
certainly you can get a hold of
us Terra therm by our website

678
00:36:16,320 --> 00:36:21,360
www.terratherm.com that you
know, all the easy stuff is

679
00:36:21,360 --> 00:36:23,680
there.
There's a page for I think about

680
00:36:23,680 --> 00:36:26,000
us and you know, a bunch of our,
our folks.

681
00:36:26,000 --> 00:36:28,920
There are technical experts.
You can get a hold of me with my

682
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:36,600
e-mail, jgalligan@terratherm.com
or by telephone 978-730-1200

683
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:39,480
will get us right, get you right
to the main office number.

684
00:36:39,920 --> 00:36:42,640
But I think, you know, our
websites got a ton of useful

685
00:36:42,640 --> 00:36:44,760
information on it.
And like I said, it's got a

686
00:36:45,240 --> 00:36:48,120
quick links where you can, you
know, contact our experts,

687
00:36:48,520 --> 00:36:51,240
Stephen Gripke or John Lashon's
or one of our other technical

688
00:36:51,240 --> 00:36:54,240
folks that could also support
you in addition to me.

689
00:36:54,920 --> 00:36:55,800
That's great.
Yeah.

690
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:58,880
I really appreciate you coming
on the show and giving our

691
00:36:58,880 --> 00:37:02,680
listeners a little more a
background on thermal treatment.

692
00:37:02,680 --> 00:37:06,040
And, you know, I think they if
they really have interest, they

693
00:37:06,040 --> 00:37:08,160
need to reach out to you because
I'm sure you have a lot more

694
00:37:08,160 --> 00:37:10,320
information to share than what
we just talked about.

695
00:37:10,640 --> 00:37:14,000
May have some visualizations you
can talk through and, and, and

696
00:37:14,000 --> 00:37:16,080
all those good things.
But I really like it what you

697
00:37:16,080 --> 00:37:19,240
guys are doing and thanks for
supporting the podcast and

698
00:37:19,240 --> 00:37:21,480
coming on the show today.
All right, great.

699
00:37:21,480 --> 00:37:23,920
Thanks for having me, Sean.
And yeah, absolutely if if folks

700
00:37:23,920 --> 00:37:26,240
are interested in learning more
about thermal treatment, they

701
00:37:26,240 --> 00:37:29,200
want to do, you know, we could
do a lunch and learn or anything

702
00:37:29,200 --> 00:37:30,880
like that.
Feel please feel free to reach

703
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:33,400
out and to make contact and we'd
love to help you.

704
00:37:34,280 --> 00:37:35,720
All right.
Thanks a lot and I'll put your

705
00:37:35,720 --> 00:37:37,480
contact information on my
website.

706
00:37:37,880 --> 00:37:39,200
All right, great.
Thank you, Sean.

707
00:37:39,200 --> 00:37:40,680
Appreciate it.
You bet.

708
00:37:40,680 --> 00:37:42,400
Thanks for listening and
watching the show.

709
00:37:42,640 --> 00:37:44,960
If you enjoyed the show then
please share it with your

710
00:37:44,960 --> 00:37:48,320
friends and Co workers on social
media and tell somebody in

711
00:37:48,320 --> 00:37:50,480
person.
Thanks for being with us, ET

712
00:37:50,520 --> 00:37:51,080
Nation.